Podcast: Play in new window | Download
Subscribe: Spotify | Email | RSS
Elevate Your Virtual Presentation Skills
Jenn DeWall:
Hi, everyone, it’s Jenn DeWall, and on this week’s episode of The Leadership Habit Podcast, we are talking with Tanis Roeder, who is the founder and president of Elevate Your Communication, an international training and consulting company that focuses on educating individuals to become exceptional communicators. Couldn’t we all benefit from better presentation skills? Tanis has spent the last decade focused on verbal and nonverbal communication skills that have served as the scaffolding for her business and have allowed her to raise over $1 million for charity. She’s a professional member of the National Speakers Association and has presented to audiences around the globe, including 25,000 youth and over 15,000 business professionals. I hope you enjoy the conversation as Tanis and I sat down to determine what we can do to be better presenters in both a virtual and live setting. Enjoy!
Meet Tanis Roeder
Jenn DeWall:
Hi everyone. It’s Jenn DeWall. And on this week’s episode of The Leadership Habit Podcast, I am talking to Tanis Roeder. And we are going to talk about one of the scarier subjects speaking. And now, for some of you, that may not be that big of a deal, but I know for some of you that could be a terrifying ordeal. And so Tanis is here to help us today to think about how we can be better virtual live speakers. So Tanis, go ahead and introduce yourself to our audience, tell them about yourself and what you do, and how do you maybe even got into, you know, wanting to help people be better speakers.
Tanis Roeder:
Absolutely. Well, thank you so much, Jenn, for having me here today. Again, my name is Tanis Roeder, and I own a company called Elevate Your Communication. Primarily what I do is speaking workshops for executives and sales teams, really anyone who is communicating in front of two or more people. So you don’t have to be standing on a large stage to benefit from the things we’re going to talk about today. If you’re talking in front of two or more people, the skills we’re going to talk about and the discussion we’re going to have can absolutely play out in your day to day life. As far as how I got to where I am today, I started speaking competitively when I was 13 years old.
One day I managed to forget my speech in front of 500 of my peers. And it was one of the most traumatic experiences I’ve ever had. But what I realized that day is I had fun with the audience. I made some jokes, they laughed, I laughed, maybe I cried, but I laughed a little too. And then at the very end, I got a standing ovation. And that day is the day that I realized it’s not about me- as a speaker- about me being perfect and having the perfect hair and the perfect content instead. It’s about our audiences. And I really gained a passion for helping people, leaders and sales teams, or really anyone who’s speaking up in front of people to connect with their audience and take the pressure off themselves. And instead, focus on what can we teach our audience? What can we bring to the table? How can we improve people’s lives? So that’s really what brought me to where I am today.
Jenn DeWall:
What a mortifying story, I’m sure for just being 13, and how we may be at that point in time, don’t have that full confidence in ourselves so that the embarrassment can feel really high. You know you did it. And so then you can remind people like, Hey, I’ve been there, I’ve had that moment where I maybe didn’t have my words memorized or what I wanted to say. And I still figured it out, and you’re making it real. Because there’s that statistic that says that people are more afraid of public speaking than death, is that right? Because that’s bananas.
Tanis Roeder:
That’s what they, yes. And that’s crazy because I don’t want to be buried, but you know,
Why Are People Afraid of Making a Public Presentation?
Jenn DeWall:
I know that there are some people that are like, Nope, Nope, no, no, no. I do not want to do that. So let’s talk about the fears. Like why do you think people are afraid of speaking? Why is it something that people would rather maybe die if that really is true, then have to go into an audience or talk to people, maybe as you said, two or more people? Why be afraid of that?
Tanis Roeder:
I think it really comes down to the fact that as human beings, we don’t want to be judged. We’re afraid of being judged. We want people to like us. And when you are in a position to be the center of attention, you have 20, 40, 60, a hundred eyeballs, all staring at you, and they’re expecting something from you, and they’re judging you. And so that can easily send us into cortisol overload. That’s our stress response that happens when we’re in a situation where we feel like we are in danger. And when we get into that cortisol mode, and things keep getting worse and worse and worse, and lots of physical things happen to our bodies, and our brains go blank. And so once we’ve been through that experience, once we think it’s going to happen every time we speak up. And so once people get good at the skills, they can overcome the fear side of speaking.
Jenn DeWall:
I got. So we’ve got to get rid of that, maybe past the assumption that because something happened once, it’s going to happen again. And I think I like to it, my coaching practice, I like to say that with clients, we think that, you know, if you get rejected on a date one time when you ask someone out that it’s going to happen for the rest of your life. But you somehow overcome that. And so I wonder why, how people can benefit if they just recognize their own resilience that they’ve had. And that’s a great point. So how can you keep that in check? How do you even start to develop a muscle that says, yes,
Tanis Roeder:
There’s definitely a few things that you can do before you speak that will help you keep your cortisol under control. Because again, we need a little bit of cortisol to give us the energy to get up and be enthusiastic in front of our audience, but we don’t want so much cortisol that we start sweating and shaking and stumbling. So we’ve got to keep it in check and the couple of things that you can do the first and foremost, number one thing, it sounds simple, but people forget to do it. And that is to breathe.
Jenn DeWall:
Right, because one of the first things that happen is you run out of breath.
Before Your Presentation, Take a Deep Breath
Tanis Roeder:
Right, because what happens is you start taking really short, shallow breaths from your chest. And so then you start to get tunnel vision. Your brain can’t think correctly because it’s not getting the oxygen that it needs. And it’s all because of the way that you are breathing. So breathing in through the nose and out through the mouth before it’s your turn to stand up and present. Or before you start, you hit live on your computer, whatever it may be. Just sit there and take a couple of really good deep breaths.
Jenn DeWall:
I’m doing this right now. As you’re talking, It’s just calming in general.
Tanis Roeder:
Exactly. And it Doesn’t have to be obvious. You don’t have to get up and go [loud exhale]. You can do it very quietly. So the second thing that I recommend keeping that cortisol in check every single time you’re in a presentation situation, you want to have your first minute memorized, and I don’t recommend memorizing entire presentations because then your brain can go into what we call cognitive overload.
Memorize the First Minute of Your Presentation
Tanis Roeder:
And if you are trying to remember word for word of presentation, if your brain can’t find the next word of the next sentence, it’ll shut down. And that’s what happened to me that day on that stage in front of all of my peers. My brain shut down. So having our first minute memorized helps us because when we get up in front of an audience, that first time that we see their eyeballs staring at us is when we are going to be the most nervous, the most scared. And that’s when a cortisol dump usually happens. If we know our first minute cold, then we can get up there and just start with a bang. And once we get through that first minute, you know, we’re going to be ready to go for the rest of the presentation and not feel like we’re struggling to get going.
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah. The first minute— that seems so much more manageable. You know, in terms of your stress level, as you’re approaching a presentation or a speaking, something where you have to talk at, you know, to feel like you’re just focusing on the first minute, just seems like I can do that. Whereas if I think that I have to do the entire thing, that’s a little bit more intimidating. I think that’s such a valuable tip.
Rest, Eat and Exercise
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah. I definitely don’t recommend memorizing. I tell people, you want to know your content by heart, but you don’t want to memorize it. If you know it by heart, you can kind of move around and go over here. And then your brain will remember something that you forgot to say, and it’ll throw it back in. But if you memorize, you get in trouble. So just that first minute. And a couple of other things that I highly recommend that you do. I want you to eat something before you present. Your brain is very glucose-sensitive. And so you need to have something in your system. It doesn’t have to be right before you eat, but maybe even a quick candy bar or something, just to give you that spike that you need. And your adrenaline will take you the rest of the way. So eat something.
Tanis Roeder:
You want to get plenty of sleep, which I know is hard. If you’re nervous about the presentation, you stay awake all night long, and you change things, and you tweak things. And the problem with that is you’re setting your brain up for failure because you’re going to get up the next day. And you’re not going to remember the changes that you made in your PowerPoint or what exactly you wanted to say here because you just changed it the night before. So I really do recommend the night before is just reserved for maybe one final practice and then a good night of sleep. And one other thing that I want to share-actually, there’s two more- right before you present or within three hours of presenting, get some type of physical exercise, and I’m not a runner, so I’m not going to put on my running shorts and go out for a 10-mile run. I do jumping jacks in the hotel bathrooms.
Jenn DeWall:
Oh, nice! But you make it work. Right? So like, I don’t want to run. I don’t want to do this. You can just move your body.
Tanis Roeder:
Yes. So you can run in place. You can do jumping jacks, whatever it is, the reason that I want you to do this. And you remember to take off your jacket before you do this. So you don’t get pit stains. Just saying.
Jenn DeWall:
I know that’s a legit problem that I have. So
Tanis Roeder:
It is for a lot of people. We all sweat, and we don’t want those big pit stains. So take off your jacket, do some jumping jacks. What you’re doing here is you’re getting your adrenaline up, and adrenaline counteracts cortisol. Win-Win! And so that’s why I want you to do it within three hours of your presentation. So you can counteract some of that cortisol. That’s inevitably going to happen when you get into this high-pressure situation.
The Spotlight Effect
Tanis Roeder:
And the last piece of advice that I give everyone is that you just have to say, so what the audience isn’t going to know, notice things, the way that you notice things. So even if you feel the sweat dripping down your back, the audience doesn’t see that. Even if you feel your hands shaking a little bit, the audience isn’t focused on that. Your brain has something called the spotlight effect. And the spotlight effect when you are in a high-pressure situation makes you believe that people are focusing on you more than they actually are.
Jenn DeWall:
Oh, Right. So spotlight, I love that. There’s a name for that, though. The spotlight effect, because that’s that message that you’re then telling yourself like everyone is noticing. And that’s just counteracting, I guess, all the work that you just did to bring your cortisol down.
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah. It just perpetuates the problem. And so learning to hear the spotlight effect and say, Tanis, the audience does not see your hand shaking. Tanis, get out there and be confident. So it’s really about the messages you send yourself. Telling yourself that you’re going to fail right before you get up to present is a really bad idea.
Visualize a Successful Presentation
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah. So, I mean, what do you visualize? I mean, I imagine like do visualize kind of success or the outcomes, or what would you say about that?
Tanis Roeder:
Not everyone is into visualizations, but I definitely am. And I visualize my audience. So typically, when I’m teaching even a presentation skills class, I’ve done this class hundreds of times, and I still get nervous every time. And that’s just me taking the situation seriously. And knowing that every time I get up to speak, I have the opportunity to impact someone’s life. So I visualize my audience, and I visualize light bulbs going off over their heads because that’s why I do what I do. I teach because I want people to learn something that they can, in turn, go out and use.
Jenn DeWall:
Well, and the better that they can feel like. I mean, I’m sure there are so many people even listening to this podcast that has a message or a point of view or insight that, because of maybe being intimidated by speaking, aren’t sharing it—and so knowing that you can give people that confidence too, you know, want to feel comfortable to share their message. And I think even drawing in the importance of nerves, that’s always, and I don’t know where I picked that up either. It’s like, if you’re not nervous, that’s when you should be concerned because then you’re not necessarily on your toes. You’re not maybe engaged in the audience or the outcome. So I that’s, I don’t know where I picked that up, but that’s always, what I heard is if you’re not nervous and there are some problems coming in, and even now for an interview or something like that, it should be a little nervous before you go in. Because that’s going to help you and make sure you’re doing your best.
Tanis Roeder:
Absolutely. Yeah. I always feel bad when someone says, Oh, I don’t get nervous to speak. I feel sorry for their audience.
Jenn DeWall:
Right. Well, and they could just be like, my message is, it’s so great. And then that is probably the first time that it’s probably not going to be the best.
Tanis Roeder:
And then they bring their body with them and there, they don’t know what to do with their body. And it gets really awkward.
Capturing the Attention of Your Audience in a Virtual Presentation
Jenn DeWall:
Yes. I mean, I’m sure you’ve seen it. I’ve seen it where you can watch someone awkwardly present. And it’s worse obviously when they have got a huge ego about what they’re talking about because you’re like, are you talking to the same audience that’s listening right now? I’m not sure that you’re connected with them. Or everyone is like, if they don’t have their phones, they’re like thinking about their weekend plans or something like that. The other thing that I always heard is that people heard this from someone, and maybe this is something you talk about, but I’ve heard that you have essentially like three seconds to make that impression on someone, to engage someone into your message. And so when you’re thinking about that opening, and if we do have such a short amount of time to like pull our audiences, I mean, does that true? Have you heard that, that we have a really short amount of time to be able to grab them?
Tanis Roeder:
I would say it’s thirty seconds. Thirty seconds is super fast. I mean three seconds, maybe visually, but 30 seconds with both the visual and auditory lobes, checking into your presentation. Really what we focus on in my speaking classes are the first thirty seconds. And I tell them again, and again, if you can nail the first thirty seconds, then you’re going to continue to soar through the rest of your presentation.
Jenn DeWall:
Yes. So we’re breaking it down, Tanis is breaking it down for you, which is, I mean, they think there are many people and I hope that they walk away and they’re like, I can do this. I can do this! But let’s okay. Let’s get into my, not my favorite, but we’ve got to talk about the failures because in this, where many of us are virtual, maybe we’re just really not that in our I’s and crossing our T’s. So we’re really forgetting to just double check that we’re coming in, but let’s talk about some failures that people might have with speaking and maybe things that people need to be mindful of. So they can hopefully learn from someone else’s mistakes.
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah. You know, I think the number one thing that causes us to fail is those messages that we send ourselves. And I’m guilty of this too. And before I go into a workshop with a bunch of executives, I’ll tell myself that they’re smarter than me, and they’re going to nail me to the wall, and I’m not going to be able to answer a question. And then, when I get up in front of them, I will have destroyed my confidence. And competence is what we call a reflexive emotion. And that means when I’m standing up in front speaking. If I can display confidence, my audience will, in turn, have confidence in me and in the material that I’m presenting. That’s incredibly important because if I get up and I stand here, and I’m awkward, and I don’t have a lot of confidence, then all of a sudden, like you said earlier, my audience checks out.
Tanis Roeder:
They’re looking at their phones. They’re not paying attention. They’re thinking about their weekend plans. And that causes me to fail as a presenter. So that’s probably the number one thing that I see people do and that I encourage people to steer away from. Now there’s obviously some funny things that have happened in this virtual world of presenting. Oh, my goodness. You know, we’re almost seven months into this, and you would think that by now, we would have it down. We would all have the equipment we need and the skills that we need. But that is definitely not the case.
Learn to Operate the Technology to Avoid Zoom Fails
Jenn DeWall:
Knowing the basics of maybe Zoom, like you’re mute and unmute. That would be a perfect one.
Tanis Roeder:
That’s a good one. I don’t know how many of you have been in meetings where you had to say, and you’re on mute. They say that that’s going to be the ultimate saying from 2020 that everyone takes away from this year. You’re on mute. We got to watch that one. We’ve also got to watch where our cameras are and when they’re on and off. I mean, I’m sure many of you have seen the “Epic fails.” I don’t need to talk about any of those, but I’ve seen some pretty interesting ones myself. I was in a writing class a couple of months ago, and our teacher came on, and she was sideways. And I don’t know if she just wasn’t paying attention or couldn’t see how she was appearing, but she taught the entire class sideways. And that was our first impression of our amazing writing teacher that we were all supposed to be listening to. And she talked to us sideways.
Jenn DeWall:
So her head was perpendicular essentially to the camera
Tanis Roeder:
She had her phone or camera turning in the wrong direction, and it wasn’t paying attention. And no one in the class said anything because they were all kind of embarrassed for her. I think they just let it go. And that was her first impression with us. And I had another one a couple of weeks ago where a director-level individual was presenting with another director. They were co-presenting. And he thought that when the other person took over the presentation and shared their PowerPoint, that the audience could no longer see him. That’s what he thought. Oh no, that is not the case on Zoom. As you know, you can see the gallery image if you have that open. And so he walked out of his office and walked into his living room, sat down on the floor, and placed this computer between his legs. And everybody noticed it. Luckily as the host, I was able to turn that off. So always important to have a host that’s paying attention to what your participants are doing. So you can shut off their camera for them.
Jenn DeWall:
Can you do that as a whole on a host functionality? Okay. That’s a valuable tip for any of you that are hosting these meetings. If you start to notice something like, you know, you can just help them save face and make sure that people aren’t distracted by something that’s taking them away from your message.
Tanis Roeder:
Yes, it is. Absolutely. I’ve turned people off. I had someone sleeping in a workshop the other day. It wasn’t my workshop, but I was the MC, and he had told me he needed to make some phone calls and was going to turn his video off. And I think he maybe thought he turned his video off, but he didn’t. And he laid down on the couch. He put his computer on his lap, and he fell asleep.
Jenn DeWall:
Oh my gosh, no, no, no, no. Oh my gosh. So if you like, basically create a checklist for yourself, then it has to start with mute and unmute as well as, where is my camera? What does that look like? You need to, at a minimum, be doing that every single time you log onto a virtual event, but people forget.
Tanis Roeder:
Know what or who is able to walk into the room or in my cat is famous for jumping. If I don’t shut the door, he jumps into my zoom calls, and everybody sees him. He just wants to say hello. He likes being the center of attention. And in a really casual team meeting, that’s one thing I’m not going to say that don’t do that in a team meeting if everybody’s laid back. But when you are in a position to present or leading a group call or doing something like that, we need to be bringing our A-game the same way we would as if we were in person.
Tips for Mastering the Virtual Presentation
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah. What are some like, so let’s go into the tips, like talking about what, how can we succeed? And I know that you focus obviously on helping to develop people to do speaking live, but, but you also do it for virtual. And so knowing that so many of us are likely either going back into virtual environments to influence as a result of the pandemic, we’re going to focus on tips for virtual presenting. But obviously, I know you have a full arsenal of things, you know if it was a live event. So I definitely want our audience to know that if they want to hear, get more access from you, but what are tips to be a better virtual presenter? I mean, starting with making sure that your camera’s in the right place and that your mute and unmute privileges are where they need to be.
Set Your Camera at Eye-Level to Make Eye-Contact During Your Presentation
Tanis Roeder:
Those are absolutely important basics of the camera. I cannot tell you how many people I see their ceiling fan, or I see just the bottom part of their face or their chest. And the key is to get your camera to eye level. And for some of you, if you’re using just a laptop and you don’t have an external camera, that might mean that you stack your Amazon boxes. I know we all have lots of Amazon boxes right now. So you can stack your Amazon boxes on top of each other and set your computer there to bring the little dot up to eye level. And that way, your audience is going to feel like you’re actually connecting with them. There’s a big difference when I’m talking to the camera than when I’m talking down to my computer, or I’m reading my notes. So we really want to focus on keeping our eyes in contact with the camera, and it takes practice.
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah, that, one’s a really important one because I think that people, you know, I’ve been in meetings where I think people, I think you’ve just, it’s so new that we just don’t where, where do I look? Do I look at the person that’s talking? Do I, you know, where do I look? But what you’re saying is make sure that your camera’s at eye level and that you’re looking at the camera, you can look at the person, but they’re going to actually feel like you’re looking at them if you’re looking at the camera, is that right?
Tanis Roeder:
That is exactly right. Yeah. If you have a hundred people on the call, they will all feel like you are looking directly at them if you’re making eye contact with the camera.
Jenn DeWall:
Okay. So get your camera ready eye level. And that you’re not having to maybe slouch, which I know my, I have an external camera that just sits above my laptop. But yeah, mine is my setup. I absolutely have a platform for my laptop. I can go on. I’ve definitely used boxes before. I have absolutely done that. If I’m ever doing a video, I’m like, okay, here’s a really tall chair. He’s a lot of boxes, and people don’t know, but you know, that bonus is that you’re just able to create a better video experience by making it eye level.
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah, absolutely. I’ve even used a ladder. So I have a ladder. That’s just about the right height. Then when you tip down the little paint tray that’s on the ladder, that’s a great place for your computer to sit.
Jenn DeWall:
Ooh, that’s a good tip. I feel like that’s a pro tip. Suppose you’re trying to think about maybe creating different backgrounds or wanting to stand or things like that. I love that idea.
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah. Well, and I even taped my notes. So my bullet points of what I wanted to talk about in that class to the ladder, because I was standing far enough back that I could see the camera and see the notes in my peripheral vision. And it was great. It worked perfectly.
Jenn DeWall:
Oh gosh. Absolutely. Okay. What’s, what’s another thing that we need to do. So we need to know where the camera’s placed and make eye contact.
Check Your Lighting
Tanis Roeder:
We must, must, must have good lighting. Just please, please, please. Because I contact is what helps us connect with you when you are speaking, when you are leading, when you are anything you’re doing. And if we can’t see your eyes because of bad lighting, then we lose out on that connection. And there are lots of different things that you can do. You don’t have to buy all the big professional lights. You can buy a ring light on Amazon.com. There are tons to choose from— from $20 to $50— anywhere in there. Just get something that’s going to give your face a little bit more light. You always want the light to be in front of you, never behind you. So that lighting is number two on my list.
Jenn DeWall:
Like that, you talked about the eyes because I don’t think I realized that that was the reason that I wasn’t necessarily connecting with someone. I mean, because it would be, you know, when I see that it’s, it’s someone that’s so dark on their screen, and then they might even have an even darker background. So then it’s just harder in general to kind of connect with their message because you feel like you can’t see that. But that one of the pieces is that because of her eyes, that’s, that’s so interesting.
Try Multiple Monitors to see the Camera and the Audience
Tanis Roeder:
You know, and one of the questions that I get all the time when I’m teaching virtual presentation classes, will I, I still want to see my audience, and I’ve got two different ways that we can handle this, the way that I did it. I took an old TV from my garage that I was going to donate. It’s super old, and I didn’t even think it worked anymore. It doesn’t have a remote, and I set it up behind my computer. And what I do is I put the gallery from zoom up on that TV screen. So the participants are actually right behind my camera. So you can do something like that. The other thing that you can do, if you don’t have any technology, you don’t want to spend any money. That’s fine is. Just step a little bit further back from your computer or scoot your chair back from your computer. Because what this does is, it allows you to have a wider area where you can look, and the audience is still going to feel like you’re looking at them. So right now, I’m looking at my screen, but Jenn, I’m guessing it still feels like I’m looking at you.
Jenn DeWall:
Yes, absolutely it does.
Tanis Roeder:
The closer you are to the camera, the more you will have to be directly in the little lens of the camera.
Jenn DeWall:
Okay. So just take a step back. I mean, that’s got to also feel a little bit more relieving, so you’re like not, you know, feeling like I’m so in their face, like I feel a little bit calmer probably by giving it a little distance. That’s where I feel. I mean, but it’s yeah. It’s I think these are such great tips and also, yeah, you don’t have to spend a lot of money to be able to make this there. I really appreciate you sharing that point because you know, it doesn’t matter. You don’t have to invest a lot of money. There are just little things that you can do to be able to make that experience that much better.
Get a Green Screen or Set Your Background Carefully
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah. I love now people always comment on the background. Oh, Tanis, that looks so good. And your hands don’t disappear. That’s because I have a green screen and all of that must be so expensive. The good news is that it’s not, you can buy little portable green screens. You can go to your local fabric store and get a green cloth. I had someone the other day tell me that she brought, she bought a bright green tablecloth, and that’s what she uses as her green screen. And so there are lots of ways to achieve this without spending hundreds and hundreds of dollars.
Jenn DeWall:
Yes, I absolutely. And you’re right. That’s a great point. I know, right in the beginning with zoom, we did use a lot of their virtual backgrounds, but because it’s not actually on a green screen, then it would create that fuzziness with your hands and your hair and all that stuff. So then I just stopped using them. But I like the idea of going back to a green screen because then you can personalize your background. I love that you have a personal brand statement. I think that’s so great to have in position when you’re presenting. Or for those that are listening. Maybe your company name, maybe the word that you’re talking about, or who knows. There’s a lot of different ways that you can leverage the power of your background.
Tanis Roeder:
And there’s a website called Canva.com. They have a ton of free zoom backgrounds that you can drop your logo into, and you can create something just like this that’s personalized for your company without paying a designer to do it and totally free. So again, you can do it on a shoestring budget. I just really encourage you to look at this because it ups your game, and people will notice since, wow. That looks really good.
Jenn DeWall:
Yes. I think the background is so important. I also got advice that, so when I was setting up my background, I got advice that you really want to kind of remove anything that would pull your audience away from your message. So maybe not heavy on a lot of books where people are going to say like, Oh, well look, did they read? Did I read that one? How to like, are we, or then they’re losing sight of your message. Like what other tips would you give for a background?
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah, absolutely. So if you don’t have a green screen and you don’t want to go that direction, you just want to find somewhere in your house. That’s relatively simple. I mean, Jenn, I love your background. You’ve got very simplistic shelves with just a couple of things on it. So after I initially get on the call, and I look at your background, and I’m not paying attention to it anymore because my brain already visually took in everything there was to take in. And now, I can focus on you and your message. It’s really important that we understand that our visual lobe is larger than our auditory lobe. So we’re always going to be focusing on our eyes before we start listening.
Jenn DeWall:
No kidding? I love learning these things!
For a Better Presentation – Limit the Words on Your PowerPoint
Tanis Roeder:
Oh, it is. It’s fascinating. That’s why PowerPoints with a ton of words is the worst thing that you can do for your audience. We think we need to put all that content up there, but really what we’re doing is we’re making our audience stop listening to what we’re saying because they’re all reading what’s on the slide.
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah, that is. Oh my gosh. I don’t know if we’re going to talk about PowerPoint and a lot of words. Because I’ve heard that you should go even on a slide that for every bullet point you shouldn’t have any more than six or seven words is that very simple.
Tanis Roeder:
People always have a panic attack when I tell them six by six, but I have never worked in any industry. I’ve worked with engineers, real estate, mortgage healthcare, every industry that I’ve worked with. We’ve been able to take very technical presentations and simplify the slides. So they are following the six by six rule. And so that they are visual instead of an overwhelming amount of just content and graphs and numbers.
Jenn DeWall:
So what’s the six by six rule. If our audience may not know what that is.
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah. So six by six is no more than six bullets per page. And yes, that counts sub-bullets. I actually don’t encourage people to use sub-bullets on a PowerPoint. That’s more of a handout—no more than six bullets per page and no more than six words per bullet.
Jenn DeWall:
Okay, everyone- six by six. I think that’s a great tip because I know I go there. When someone throws, you know, 50 words on a PowerPoint, well, then I’m trying to read it. I don’t want to go away from the speaker because I don’t want to feel like I’m not listening, but I actually have checked out. So now I’m just focused on reading.
Tanis Roeder:
A good rule of thumb. Is that a period? It should never ever be in a PowerPoint.
Jenn DeWall:
Got it. Yeah, just points. Okay. I like that one too. That should make it easier for some people maybe that are planning a presentation that you don’t have to put everything, just do enough. That it’s going to be a prompt for you or a prompt for your audience to know the talking point and what you want them to remember. So what’s another tip that you would recommend for people that are presenting virtually?
Watch Your Body Language
Tanis Roeder:
The interesting thing is people feel like this is such a different form of communication, and it is to a certain extent, but when it comes to the presentation side of things, the same skills that I teach for in-person apply virtually. You still want to have good eye contact. You still want to have a strong stance. So I always say, don’t be wiggling because even when I’m moving my feet, you see it up top. If I’m swaying, that can be really distracting. So you want to have a strong stance.
Tanis Roeder:
And I want to be able to see your hands every now and again, which is a little bit harder on a computer screen because you have to bring them up higher than you do when you’re in person. But the reason that I want to see your hands is because the palm of your hand is very important. It shows people that you are open. You are honest. You are ready to connect with them. You’re not hiding anything. And so using gestures that show the palm of your hands makes a big difference in how you connect with your audience and other things.
Jenn DeWall:
That one’s a new one for me. Okay. So palms facing audiences.
Tanis Roeder:
Yes. Even if you’re relatively close to your screen. And you’re sitting here. You can still bring your hands up every once in a while or make a gesture here or something along those lines. And then the last one is really to remember, to get your voice involved. We sometimes get bored because we are by ourselves, you know, in our offices, with nobody to give us any feedback. We can’t see people’s facial expressions as well. And we forget that if we lose our vocal variety, then all of a sudden, people are going to check out because they’re bored of listening to the same voice and staying in the same pattern that has no emphasis. That’s just really consistent. Instead, we want to make sure that we’re adding emphasis, and we’re going up, and we’re going down with our pitch, just really showing our audience that we’re excited to be here. And we’re excited to talk about whatever topic we’re going to talk about. Your audience is going to be a little less excited than you are. And every time you speak, whether it’s virtually or in person, you set the enthusiasm level in the room or in the Zoom call. So you can do that with your voice.
Get Bigger for a Virtual Presentation—Not Smaller
Jenn DeWall:
I, gosh, I think, you know, for virtual presenting, I always try to just be big. I feel like I am bigger than I’ve ever been on stage. I am much bigger even when I’m just behind the camera because I’m so, I guess, concerned that I don’t want my audience to all of a sudden be like, Jenn, thanks for talking about communication or this and not buy into it. So I feel like I use a lot of props. I’ve got my fancy microphone with my karaoke microphone. I try to use things and be even just that much bigger just to make sure that people are paying attention to me and not looking at that next tab on their screen.
Tanis Roeder:
Yeah, you, you are in a bucket of few. Most people that I’ve seen presented in this virtual world go the exact opposite direction. They get quieter because they’re nervous that there’ll be too loud on the other person’s computer. That other person can adjust their volume. The volume of your voice is really equal to the amount of confidence that you’re displaying. So if you talk softly and your audience is never going to see you as confident. However, when you bring your voice up to an appropriate volume, all of a sudden audience goes, wow, this person knows what they’re talking about, and they’re confident, and I’m confident in them. So really making sure that you are vigor, you do a great job of that. And I encourage everyone, no matter what industry you are in, no matter what type of presentation you are giving, to be a little bit bigger virtually than you maybe originally would have.
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah. Well, and I think that’s a good point too, for the people that might think, Oh my gosh, I’m talking so loud, and you’re in virtual. They can always reduce the volume. You don’t have to control that. They can control that for themselves. So, you know, take that and throw it out of your brain because it’s one less thing that you need to worry about that might give you a little bit of nerves. Yes. I need to. I love all these little, like trying to use more hand gestures.
Tanis Roeder:
It’s harder in a virtual world. It definitely is because you have to make more, a conscious effort to do that.
Dress Professionally—Top to Bottom
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah, absolutely. You know, one of the things that you had touched on was how to dress. Why do people forget that dress still matters in a virtual environment? Why do we forget that?
Tanis Roeder:
It’s because, in the beginning, the big joke was we all get to work in our pajamas now, and that was fine for the first two months. It was, we all gave each other a ton of slack, and it was totally relaxed and no big deal. But now we expect more. We expect you to show up the same way you would when you’re in person, which means that no, you can’t wear your boxer shorts on the bottom half. You do need to put pants on, and you know, have a nice blouse or a blazer or whatever it is. Dress the exact same way you would as if we were in person together.
Jenn DeWall:
People! Remember, you’re still influencing your audience if you’re on camera. So you want, you know, it’s not to say that every zoom meeting requires a more formal look, but know your audience. Know who you might be trying to influence what maybe they would be wearing. I know that even anytime I talk about my business, I feel like I do it in a way that I’m live interacting with someone. Like that’s how I treat it. And that’s most of my zoom meetings, but I just want to make sure that I’m there. But I know for me, confidence is huge when it comes down to what I’m wearing. If I came in here with the sweatshirt that I had on earlier, I probably wouldn’t project the same level of confidence. I mean, it’d be warmer, but yes, confidence.
Tanis Roeder:
No, it’s absolutely true. That’s actually why I stand up. Even in most of the meetings that I have, if I’m pitching a new client, if I’m doing a, you know whatever it is, most of the time I’m standing in my zoom calls because it just raises my level of confidence and raises what I bring to the table.
Jenn DeWall:
Yeah. Stand up. So by the, you know, I need to buy one, I know I do a standing desk, but by a standing desk or just move your computer, like till the ladder, you can do that. If you have a meeting that you’re presenting on and have it so you can stand and make yourself bigger, I guess. I mean, I feel like it would just be more comfortable with standing like that would be. That’s the thing that I’m starting to get more sick of. It’s just sitting because it’s just not as comfortable doing it. One meeting after another, after another,
Tanis Roeder:
Your brain needs that movement. And I don’t encourage you to move while you’re talking, but maybe while someone else is sharing their piece, you know, you can just move your legs a little bit, and you’re not just sitting around all day.
Jenn DeWall:
No, that’s. So before we go, I know you just covered a lot in terms of what people can do to be a better virtual presenter. I know we can’t go all-in on live, but what are some maybe high-level tips that you would have for someone if they are going to do a live presentation?
Live Presentations Aren’t That Different
Tanis Roeder:
Sure. I like, I mean, again, you’re using a lot of the same skills, so you’re going to work on your gestures and your stance. Eye contact is one of the most powerful skills that we have. And when you are live, you have the opportunity to use eye contact to really develop a relationship with your listeners. And every single person that I’ve coached with the exception of maybe a handful. I have encouraged them to slow down their eye contact. We have a tendency when we get nervous, and we’re presenting live to look around the room very quickly, and we’re looking, and we’re looking, and we’re looking above people’s heads and, and that actually is really taxing on our brain instead, what I want you to do the next time you’re speaking with two or more people, I want you to really focus on staying with each person a little bit longer than you normally would for you might feel a little bit uncomfortable, but I guarantee at the end of the conversation, if you ask the other people, they would say, no, that was great.
Tanis Roeder:
They may even walk away and say, wow, I feel like she was really listening to me. When when you look at people, that’s what makes them understand that you are really listening to what they have to say when it’s a two-way conversation, and it helps them connect when it’s a one-way conversation. So eye contact, eye contact, eye contact! Practice it, get feedback on it, record yourself if you’re doing a virtual presentation, and watch your eyes. But when you’re live, really work on slowing that down, and then with the gestures, you’re going to get bigger when your life, obviously I would have to back way up in order to get much bigger with my gestures. But if I were in a room of 50 people, my gestures would need to be bigger for the audience to see them. And for them to really understand how my gestures are showing them what I feel and what I’m saying. There’s a reason that we have gestures. So we want to make sure that we use them and that we use big ones when we are in person. And when we’re in virtual, at least get them involved a couple of times. So that’s a few things that are different between virtual and live, but good tips and things you can practice on a daily basis. Yeah, absolutely.
Tanis Roeder:
If you’re virtual, what a nice gift that we actually do have the opportunity where we can set up a mini Zoom session, and we can practice it there, and we can prove ourselves and do that. That, I mean, that’s a pretty nice gift. Yeah. I and I’ve called family members and said, Hey, would you jump on real quick? And let me know what you think of these slides. And if you can read them or, you know, if my camera’s set up, Hey, am I blurry? Is the lighting good? And so I can get a ton of feedback before I hit go live on a zoom call, which I wouldn’t be able to get if I were live in-person. So that is a huge advantage.
What is Your Leadership Habit for Success?
Jenn DeWall:
Yes, absolutely. Well, Tanis, thank you so much for sharing all these insights with our listeners. I’ve got to close with the final question that we close every podcast with, which is: what is your leadership habit for success?
Tanis Roeder:
You know, I gave a lot of thought to this. And what I realized is that it’s actually a piece of advice that I give to people in my speaking class, but it doesn’t just apply to speaking. And that is that the small things make a really big difference. In speaking, small things maybe eye contact or gestures and stance. But as a leader, the small things are saying thank you to your team members, acknowledging what someone has done. Dropping someone a thank you note, or a little gift on their desk, or sending it in the mail. Those little things make a huge difference. And not only how you are perceived as a leader, but how the people who are on your team want to follow you and want to be a part of your team. So just remember the small things make a really big difference.
Jenn DeWall:
So that’s a great closing tip. I think you can apply that in a lot of different ways, too, just to remind yourself, don’t have to tackle it all at once. It doesn’t have to be a grandiose gesture, but it’s just the little things that add up to become memorable. Tanis, thank you so much for joining us on the leadership habit podcast and helping our audience become better virtual facilitators and live facilitators. I, if you guys apply these tactics that Tanis just shared, feel free to share them with us. We want to hear the results of you trying this, but Tanis, thank you so much for joining us.
Tanis Roeder:
Thank you so much, Jenn, for having me!
Jenn DeWall:
Thank you so much for listening to today’s episode of the leadership habits podcast. It was a great conversation with Tanis Roeder, and I hope you felt the same. If you want to connect with her and you can learn more about her training and workshops at ElevateYourCommunication.com. You can also connect with her on social media, where she’s going to share a variety of communications, speaking, and body language tips. You can connect with her on LinkedIn or on Facebook. And then, you can also connect on Twitter @Taniselevates and on Instagram at @tannisroeder. Thank you so much for listening. If you liked today’s episode, don’t forget to share this with your family and friends. And of course, write us a review on your favorite podcast stream and service until next time.
